mum to be angry at the csa valuation of our family
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- mum to be angry at the csa valuation of our family
21/8/08 09:10
21/8/08 09:07
Lol Kathy, I feel like I'm going through therapy on here too. At least that's one thing, we can vent our angry on Bounty. It must do some good hey?
Anyone else feel like that? Before I started coming on here I felt like I was the only person going through this, then i saw Dracona's thread. It makes you realise that others are going through the same thing and know exactly how you feel. Thanks girls. Jo
21/8/08 08:37
I forgot to say, the CSA did there calculation on my kids before i did anual declaration, we 25 a week down now and they wont adjust the payment so they are taking into account money we dont even get. DD goes out tomorrow and its grating on me AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH.
Never mind they say time is a great healer. Anyway got to go now and work out a budget my little boy is 2 next week and we got no money for his presents, how is that fair! I feel really bad for my kids. They dont have nike trainers or really nice clothes they have to make do with each other cast offs, winter coming up soon which means a whole new warderobe for 3 kids and i cant afford it. AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH again! LOL
21/8/08 08:28
Its outragous what they do and to say its cause loads of arguments to is a understatement. We DH told me his ex was pg i did consider walking walking away and sometimes i really wish i did, because i had to ask my self is it all really worth it. We have 3 kids together now so walking away is not an option, like like you viky i would not be with someone who had kids. Its all a bit wierd cause when me and DH got together he did not have any kids. Im sick of people thinking that all men are w****kers if they walk away, some people dont seem to realise that there are girls out there just as bad if not worse. My DH uses the CSA to ease his mind about this but having kids was so important to him. DH mum and dad spilt up when he was 9 and then tragically his brother was killed in a car accident 13 years ago. he had very strict rules about wanting all his kids together so they would never have to feel like he did (it affected him really badly). Thats why he did not want her baby cause they would not ever get back together and he did not want a baby he did not live with. Sometime i think if he had not met me then he probably would have gone back cause he is a lovely guy, but then he says not and he does not usually say thing he does not mean. He is as straight as a die. DH says he can hold his head high now he pays but says he will never be a father to her child. We were saving up money for him but the CSA when they made their assesment, they rang up DH and demanded £2500 by the end of the week. So we used the money we were saving up for him to pay off arreas cause they threatened to take it straight from payroll where he works or go into our bank account and take it. (they could try mind you nothing in there most of the time). So the childs mother has ruined that for her boy to now cause he would have had a nice little nest egg for when he is older, but now he wont get a penny from us or the family. He is nearly 4 now so she get her funding for nursery, no reason why she cant get a job apart from she never worked in her life. she already had 2 kids when her boy was born. She tryed to control my hubby cause she did not want to live on a rough council estate and wanted to move to where i live, which is a lovely little village in the country. No wonder she wanted my hubby he could provide the perfect life style for her 3 kids. I just hope she realises what she has done. Its not her that will be hurt but her poor boy who is going to have to listen to why his father does not want him and my DH will tell him the truth cause lying is not him at all. I hope i will be able to welcome him into our family but to tell you the truth he prob wont do very well cause his mother is not a good role model, no decent work ethic and she not to clever to be honest so i dont think he will come to much. I just hope he does not get into to much trouble with the law and such. Even when i had my 1st baby i went back to work full time when he was 4mths old and i was only 20 cause self respect is important to me and i wanted my son brought up properly.
Anyway ladies the dole is prob not an option for us, they would turn us down and say we live in to nice a house or something daft.
We can hold our heads high and say at least we work for a living and are teaching our own children how to become decent members of society who contribute towards to country, not a scrounger who cant be bothered.
Wow i feel like im having therapy.
20/8/08 21:17
God it is awful! I really feel for you guys - Who invented the CSA???!!
It is all so wrong that tax credits should be affected too..... In fact its downright disgusting and simply not fair! Poor innocent children suffering when theyre mums and dads trying to work every hour they can and no better off because of some idiotic, selfish excuses for women!
Better all going on income support and having free time to be with our kids and do what we want when we want - after all, not really better off working and it saves the added pressure of work, finding childcare etc and CSA crippling innocent families by taking money left right and centre!!
20/8/08 20:46
Vicky.
20/8/08 16:10
From the sounds of it were all in pretty bad situations. To me what is the point in any of us working, the moeny we earn is just taken straight from us. As for taking the child tax credits we get for OUR children is ridiculous. We get that for the children we have just like she gets it for there daughter so why take a cut of ours, does anyone know how much of a cut it is % wise. Like you said why give us money in one hand and take it back with the other. To be honest if i ever had my time again as much as i love my partner to pieces i wouldnt make a relationship with anyone that already had children. It may seem selfish in a way, but i hate the way our relationship is always 3 people (meaning his ex). I want it just to be our little family, which is never going to happen and i guess we just ahve to get on with it.
I would love to signt the petition as well if you could message me it please x
20/8/08 12:24
You sound like you have had a really hard time. I dont think the young lady in question is as bad as the other women you have trouble with, but she was in a bad place at the time as thought the my DH would be the one to rescue her from her situation, so she told him she was on the pill and got herself pg. My husband would never sleep with someone with out protection but he trusted her, even tho why he did that when he hardly knew her is beyond me. Anyway when she rang and told him she was pg and my DH was having none of it. He told her it was a stupid idea for them to have a baby as they would never get back together but she went ahead anyway. We actually thought she was lying as we hears nothing for about 3 mths. during that time we had fell in love and knew we wanted to be together so we got pg. At the time we had no reason not to both free, on the day i found out i was pg a letter arrived from her with a scan photo telling him how happy she was they were having a baby together. She really thought he would go back to her. DH refused to even speak to her (which did not help) so i rang her. I told her i was pg and that he would not being getting in touch and what he said in the begining still stood. Unfortunatly for her she hardly knew my DH otherwise she would have known he meant it. It all got a bit hairy when her baby was born she was constantly writing to him begging him to talk to her, but still he wouldent. In the end i wrote her a letter telling her exactly what the situation was and where we all stood. i was not unkind as in a certain was i feel sorry for her to be so weak. Since then we only had 1 letter telling us the CSA were after him. While the CSA were sorting out our case i was pg with our 3rd baby, a week after giving birth i was filling assesment forms and its ruined my pg as we had dna test and it took ages to sort out and im sick of it. Im struggling to move on tho and it burns me up inside sometimes but cant let it go. DH says iv got to forget about it but what is going to happen when he turns up. I fear the future and its wrecking the present. Im pg again (accident this time) and i feel guilty for keeping my baby because of our money situation but DH would not here of a termination he said whatever happens we will manage. This is the most honest iv ever been about this because i cant tell DH as he feels bad enough about this. I hate the fact he has another child, i hate the fact he will turn up and i hate the csa. I feel so ashamed feeling like this and guilty because i had a baby at 19 and the dad did not want me to keep it but i did anyway. Boy being on both sides of the fence has shook me up beyond word and has caused me to question what i did 12 years ago. All this is ruining my life at the moment. I cant seem to find any middle ground. Im 33 so you would have thought i could handle this. I love my husband that much and i cant stand the thought of this being here for the rest of our lives. I hope im not a bad person but i cant help the way i feel. Sorry got off the subject of csa and i hope you dont feel to badly of me.
20/8/08 12:08
Kathy, I have 4 children too and worse thing about the CSA is that, they only give you discount for 3 of the 4 children but take the percentage of tax credits awarded for 4 of the children. If you know what I mean. lol
20/8/08 12:03
I've already signed it Draconia.
20/8/08 11:44
kathy i really feel for you honey, my dp had a similar situation with one of his exes where she said she was pregnant, and she'd actually lied about contraception as well as sleeping around when they were together. and she was also violent, she has threatened me, and she has actually attacked him, but we didnt report it because of fear of the kind of barbarians her and her family are. she actually left her baby in the middle of a crowd and jumped over a table at a carboot to attack him while i was pregnant, and the next day, filed for the csa. so she did it out of spite basically. she drinks, smokes, goes out and has holidays and does all sorts of things, the baby has crap whilst she seems always to be doing something destructive, i have no doubt that she spends the csa money on the booze she drinks outside the house her mother bought her, not that child.
the other one, claims benefit, has a partner in the army and flings behind his back while he is away. her family were also violent to dp, i actually worked with her sister once, and the things i heard, well, lets say i havent told dp half of it. that little boy is now around ten years old, we know only which school he goes to and the last time dp saw the mother she was all geared up in designer gear, had another baby, and showed him a picture of the little boy, well big boy now, on her £300 phone and says hes ok but we still, well dp, cant see him and its up to him what he does when hes older, but that she wont allow it because it would upset her new fella too much. wtf is that about. she cheated on dp, with a guy they'd had a threesome with, left him, kept having casual sex in exchange for dp having their son while she went out on the p***, and then stopped it all because she said her family didnt approve of dp and got her new fella to threaten him.
both of these women are absolute cows, and i have to work, losing time with my children, just so we can scrape by? and they can take not only money off dp, but my childrens tax credits? that money is for my kids not theirs but the thick b***s at the csa think my kids should do without for them? it disgusts me. all we do as a new family is lose out big time, moneywise, we lose out on time with our kids for working so much just to survive, we lose out because that little girls family are too violent and thuggish for us to dare to risk trying for access (but shes peachy with dps mother of course, who shows more interest in that girl than either of mine) but attacks dp, oh and because the boys mother thinks its inappropriate because she got bored and wanted a new fella, and now its been nearly 7years and so is pointless anyway to even try for access?
i agree fathers should pay.but i also think that if they are going to pay, the csa should enforce that the paying fathers have access unless there is damn good reason for them not to.
i dont agree nrp and their new families should be financially crippled.
i dont agree that the parent with care should have all the rights.
i dont agree any other child should have any of the tax credits given to my children (take from mine to give to them when they get their own? how is that fair?)
i dont agree that the lifestyle and income of the parent with care isnt considered as well.
and i dont agree that women who love a man who has other children from another relationship should have to sacrifice their relatioship with their own children to work more to make up for how much is taken from their finances.
i have a petition re the csa if anyone wants me to msg them the link for it. and its not biased its calling for the system to be fairer to both sides.
20/8/08 10:45
Thanks for being so nice, not every one understands. The CSA are animals. we have 4 boys but they only take three into consideration because if a man had 4 kids to provide support for he only pays for three. Its barmy. Better than it was tho when they first started up men were killing themselves because they did not take anything including kids into consideration, and could not cope with the payments. You are right tho kids are expensive but we provide his share of rent, gas electric and food even tho it goes straight back to that fat pig Gordon Brown. My kids dont have 243 per month, if the girl had any sence she would get a job cause then that money will be in her hand, to do as she sees fit. I have to save a scrape to get shoes for my boys and we both work. My DH got proper stiched up. Anyway with the 10 she gets she can have 20 fags and a bottle of wine on me. What is the point my DH keeps saying he should go on the dole we keep working more hours to cover the outgoings and with tax for this stealth tax for that, the csa, the goverment are destroying people my hubby deductions are nearly £1500 per month and that before he gets paid, yet apart from child benefit and 35 per week tax credit for 4 kids we get no help at all. Another thing that really got me was the CSA took my tax credit into account as my DH income. As far as i am concerned that money is paid to me to help bring up my kids but they take a percentage of that to. It really made me angry cause that is not his income its mine and my kids are going without now. Its an impossible situation that will nwever be resolved until the child leaves school. Even tho we were informed we would have to pay until the child is 19. To that i say no chance i though you became an adult at 18 so why pay child support to an adult. It make no sence at all.
20/8/08 10:33
They do take some money off for nrp's new children, however they then take percentage of the tax credits awarded for the nrp's children. Given in 1 hand and taken from from the other. CSA it's a losing battle really.
20/8/08 10:02
aaww kathy... i feel for you it must be awful and i cant begin to imagine what ur going thru, but u say it doesnt cost £57 for one child??I have say I disagree as i think that children r very expensive especially as they get older! Also income support for 1 child is around that amount per week, or more if she is recieving child tax credit for the child instead (along with child benefit). I cant understand the childs mother tho as she wont get any of the money from your dh if she is on benefits.... maybe the first £10 but they take it another way lol. I would rather do without to be honest, especially at the expense of other children. I couldnt do it.
Can you not find out some advice on getting the payments lowered as this does seem an awful lot when you have 4 children. The CSA are horrible - i dont know who made the rules up but obviously didnt habe any kids or feelings when they did it!!
Hope ur ok x
19/8/08 22:39
Kathy, I know how you are feeling, we have 4 children too and have to pay £250 to dh's ex. It is so finacially hard and the CSA don't give a damn about the nrp's new families. I know some parents with care don't get a penny, such as the the previous poster. Which is terrible too. My problem is with the CSA and the terrible state in which they are leaving some families.
I feel so much for your senario, and the fact that your partner had no say in what happened to him. It's just typical that the parent with care holds all the cards, stuff the nrp. Makes me sick.
19/8/08 20:53
I have had a similar problem. When i met my DH we were both single and free. About a month after we started seeing each other his ex rang him and tol him she was pg. As it was a casual and they has already split up cause my DH was being threatened by her exs family. He told her that he did not want the baby and no good would come of it if she did. Naturally she had the baby and my DH has not spoken to the young lady in question since she told him she was pg. He got a letter with a scan photo in it telling him how glad she was they were having a baby together. My DH was gutted he thought there was no baby as she text him telling him she wanted him back but there was no mention of a baby. Anyway to cut a long painful story short, the CSA got in touch last year and it took them 10 mths to sort it out. We pay £243 per month and it crippling us. We have 4 boys already and im pg with our 5th even tho my youngest is only 4mths. Both me and DH feel guilty because my DH is a great dad and the child in question is missing out in a big way but he refuses to see him and he has very good reasons. Please dont think my DH is a bad person but he felt backed into a corner and his feelings were not considered at all. All he had was hassle from her ex's family calling him horrid names and even threatened to burn his dads house down and he trully thinks that if he saw this child trouble would start. We pay 243 per month but at least my DH can hold his head high and say he paid for his actions. If the child wants to come and find him he can but i dont know as it will be a happy meeting. I find this very difficult and its hard to talk about as most people think he is a w*****er but he is not. he is a kind man who felf taken advantage of and feels like he was being trapped. The CSA are outragous and do not reflect the true price of bringing up children. My ex gives me 100 per month and it does not cost £57 per week for 1 child. There is nothing to be done about it just bite the bullet and pay up cause im sure she only wanted my DH to be a cash cow and it not fair. The only thing that really bothers me is that iv worked full time for 15yrs and paid my tax and stamp and now i want to give up work for a few years to bring up my children i cant cause of the CSA ,and the young lady in question is on benefits and does nothing. Iv nothing agaist people on benefit but i cant help but feel bitter and cheated. Anyway this is my story please no one be horrid we have been to hell and back over this and i will probably cry.
17/8/08 20:54
To the previous poster, Like Vicky said your situation is totally different and I feel for ladies like you. He is obviously a no hoper and you will do so much better with out him.
Hope every thing works out for you. Jo x
17/8/08 12:06
Aaaww yes that is awful... I couldnt afford to smoke even if i wanted to! I dont know how ppl do it to be honest - my kids come first and if they need sumthing they get it and i walk around in rags and holey shoes hahaha (not actually that bad lol) Me and my fiance only go out if there is a wedding or birthday and more importantly if i can afford it. (which is about 4/5 times a year. Even New years eve, we take the kids out with us to a bowling party at our local bowling alley!!
Their father has never paid me a penny in maintenance (apart from £5 week when the CSA got in contact with him and he went on jobseekers allowance and thats only been the last 3 months) he goes out to the pub every night, gets blind drunk and gets upto no good which i wont go into - i dont want that for my boys. They deserve better.
I also hope that everything goes well. For the sake of my kids too. I dont want them getting hurt all over again when me and my fiance have just got them thru his last set of games and back on track! We have a decent life, go on holiday twice a year and generally enjoy a family life. We wouldnt have it any other way!
I just want to be left to bring my boys up to be decent and considerate of other people (their father and his family has a history of violence, fraud, drugs and generally being an ar*e!!) Sorry for the ramble.......* )
Thank you so much for your best wishes x
16/8/08 23:01
To the previous poster, i really feel for your situation. In your case its totally differnet your ex obviously doesnt want to make that much of an effort for his children and you have every reason for him not to see your children. However there are some mothers who have no suitable reason and stop it because they feel like it. In our case my dps been fighting for 4 years and only now is she doing what the court has said because shes been warned they will take her daughter from her and she will come to live with us.
As for money i understand what you mean about keeping a roof over there head and gas, electric, food etc. But what really gets me is when she gets the money on a saturday, she doesnt have daughter all weekend, and can buy a 20 packet of cigs every day and spend all the money on herself. She gets the best there daughter gets very little. I hope court goes well for you at the minute it looks like it is and your children with better off without a man like that in their life when clearly from what youve said hes only wanting to know what your doing x
16/8/08 16:46
I dont want to sound horrible here, but the way i see it is, this man should pay for his children. He 'went halves' so therefore should contribute to their upbringing. I know it is hard but it is necessary and there is no reason why you both cant work hun.
As for proof of what the money is spent on, i think that is ridiculous and i had the same problem with my ex when i asked him for help ( i asked for £30 a week for 2 children) - its as if kids dont eat, use electricity, gas and need clothing/shoes!! That is what the money is spent on - keeping a roof over their heads and clothing and feeding them - my ex wanted me to buy them a toy/present every week and give him the receipt hahaha!! joke
As a result he has never paid me ANYTHING - oh apart from £20 which he threw at me one day when he had an audience ( i ripped it up!) - he used to beat me up, control me and reduced me to a total mess. I was so ashamed i let him do that to me and my kids so i got out after 10 years. BEst thing i ever did. The CSA found him and he had to pay £86 a week as he was working full time and at that time i was working and i never got a penny - he then went onto jobseekers allowance and now works illegally - told me i didnt deserve help towards the children!! I now get £5 a week for 2 kids - it doesnt even pay for a mcdonalds as they have adult meals now!! A complete joke!!
He didnt see the boys for over a year after we split when he suddenly decided, after he'd found out id met another man and i was pregnant and we were all happy, that he wanted to see them. He harrassed me, threatened me and accused me of cheating for months. He was still trying hard to control me. And when he did see the boys he taunted them, called me horrible names and threatened/bribed them with money and gifts and told them that their sister wasnt their sister!! They ended up scared and didnt wanna see him. Cafcass had to come and see the boys and ask them how they felt and they told him - he concluded that they didnt want to see him and he felt it was best if they didnt, but their 'father' would not have it. He even got angry with the cafcass officer!! As a result, I am still going thru the courts and he was found by the judge on thurs (after a finding of fact hearing) to be lying thru his teeth about me being unfaithful and him harrassing me - as i had police logs and photographs of injuries caused by him and tapes of threatening telephone calls. He even said one of my injuries were due to a drunken fall!! The judge called him a 'controlling, manipulative and unreasonable man' and said 'he needed to look in the mirror and realise what hes done to me and how he has affected me and his children and to think of these 2 young boys and not me and my life'.
He now has to undergo a domestic violence course and send the boys cards and letters to prove sum commitment, but hes not bothered bout the boys - his main concern is ME and what im doing!! We'll see how it goes.
SO i suppose my main point is that, if ur dp really wants to see his kids, he could do so, be it slowly and at a pace to suit the kids. If he doesnt work, legal fees will be paid and shouldnt have to pay full maintenance (i get £5 a week for 2 kids!!!!) But you should deffo seek some advice about this as if it causing you poverty and hardship, the CSA will reduce payments - worth a try. Hope this helps and please dont think im trying to upset u, im merely giving you an insight into my situation and some friendly advice
x
Moraitika, just to let you know I did look into the thing about how long you have to pay and it is definately 19, but thanks any way. jo x